ES Forum Archive > Morrowind Mods > [WIP] Save keeper. Beta testers wanted.
I'm not really sure what the proper forum for this is, but this will do I guess.
As most of the probably know, saving over an existing game case lead to corrupted saves. Unfortunately this applies to the Quicksave and Autosave features too. It doesn't happen all the time, but often enough that some people will advise against using them at all. I don't know about anyone else, but I consider that a big pain.
So I made a little utility that automatically renames your Quicksaves and Autosaves to prevent them from being overwritten directly. It does a little more than that actually, but that's the main feature. Would anyone like to help me test it? It works for me, but I'd like to have a couple other people give it a try before I call it done. And preferably at least one person running Vista.
If you've experienced the save corruption bug yourself, you're a particularly good candidate.
As most of the probably know, saving over an existing game case lead to corrupted saves. Unfortunately this applies to the Quicksave and Autosave features too. It doesn't happen all the time, but often enough that some people will advise against using them at all. I don't know about anyone else, but I consider that a big pain.
So I made a little utility that automatically renames your Quicksaves and Autosaves to prevent them from being overwritten directly. It does a little more than that actually, but that's the main feature. Would anyone like to help me test it? It works for me, but I'd like to have a couple other people give it a try before I call it done. And preferably at least one person running Vista.
If you've experienced the save corruption bug yourself, you're a particularly good candidate.
That is sweet!
One of the problems I've read about with Quicksave doesn't have to do with corruption, but with how it actually saves games. Quicksave doesn't always save all data concerning running scripts, so when you go to load up your last Quicksave, you get lots of errors and some of your mods are no longer running properly. That's why I tell people not to use Quicksave.
QUOTE(Nerra @ Jun 10 2007, 07:50 PM) 
One of the problems I've read about with Quicksave doesn't have to do with corruption, but with how it actually saves games. Quicksave doesn't always save all data concerning running scripts, so when you go to load up your last Quicksave, you get lots of errors and some of your mods are no longer running properly. That's why I tell people not to use Quicksave.
Hmm, so there may be multiple problems with quicksave, huh? This may not be too useful then. I don't want to give people a false cure. Do you know of anywhere (or anyone?) I can go to for more complete technical details of the problem(s)?
The technical posts I read about Quicksave have long been purged from this forum.
It all depends on how 'clean' of a game you're playing. If your active mod list consists of a bunch of face & hair mods, maybe a race mod or two, and some texture replacers, using Quicksave shouldn't be much of a problem.
If however you're using script heavy mods like Combat Enhanced, Vampire Realism, Morrowind Comes Alive, or quest mods like White Wolf Of Lokken Mountain, The Underground, The Black Mill, The Glory Road, and Annastia, you should avoid using Quicksave.
It all depends on how 'clean' of a game you're playing. If your active mod list consists of a bunch of face & hair mods, maybe a race mod or two, and some texture replacers, using Quicksave shouldn't be much of a problem.
If however you're using script heavy mods like Combat Enhanced, Vampire Realism, Morrowind Comes Alive, or quest mods like White Wolf Of Lokken Mountain, The Underground, The Black Mill, The Glory Road, and Annastia, you should avoid using Quicksave.
If you can do something with what Nerra told you and you get it to work, then i would love to test it for
you. I to would like to be able to use quicksave and auto save. But since i hat my share of problems
concerning those two functions i don't use them at the moment.
(At least i would like to test, as long as i don't need MGE. My comp can't handle it.
)
you. I to would like to be able to use quicksave and auto save. But since i hat my share of problems
concerning those two functions i don't use them at the moment.
(At least i would like to test, as long as i don't need MGE. My comp can't handle it.
)
Hello,
If you could get it to work, it would be great ManaUser.
Unfortunately, I read the same thing as Nerra about the problems occuring with quicksaves.
Bjam
If you could get it to work, it would be great ManaUser.
Unfortunately, I read the same thing as Nerra about the problems occuring with quicksaves.
Bjam
It's awfully hard to know how to deal with these kind of intermittent problems until someone figures out precisely what cuases them. I've heard claims that both Quicksave and saving over existing slots what dangerous. I had been working under the assumption that Quicksave was dangerous because it normally saves over an existing slot every time. But if the quicksave function itself is broken there's but much I can do about it. I'd still like a to see a better explanation of exactly what's happening. I don't suppose anyone saved those old posts on the topic?
I'd still like a to see a better explanation of exactly what's happening. I don't suppose anyone saved those old posts on the topic?
I have played MW for hundreds of hours & I have never once had a corrupt quicksave & I quicksave alot!
I "name" save alot too.
I "name" save alot too.
QUOTE(Darknut @ Jun 11 2007, 11:40 AM)
I have played MW for hundreds of hours & I have never once had a corrupt quicksave & I quicksave alot!
I "name" save alot too.
I "name" save alot too.
I'm not surprised. It seems very unpredictable when this problem will turn up. As Nerra said, it does appear that a heavyer load of mods makes it more likely but beyond it's a mystery (to me, anyway).
I have a suggestion. Go into the game and make a new save. Then immediately save again, but overwrite an existing file. Then save one more time using quicksave. Compare these three files in Enchanted Editor to see what exactly is different. If overwriting a file truly causes issues, could you alter your program to do what it does for "named" saves?
Unless you know what to look for a "corrupted" save may well be hard to detect for the gamer who just plays and doesn't get too technical. Gamers like me 
I've had lots of errors before, but often they seem to have come about from messing around adding/removing/editing mods - and I run several script-heavy mods (MCA, Creatures, NoM, Romance etc.) The latest was to do with Dongle's Ranger Tent mod; I pitched it outside of the two shops in Pelagiad, whenever I tried to remove it the game would CTD. This happened when I tried to remove it via the tent's own removal method and when that failed, console->disable. So I don't know what happened there, whether it was a save that became corrupt or if the mod [censored] out somehow.
The point of my post is in the first line
I've had lots of errors before, but often they seem to have come about from messing around adding/removing/editing mods - and I run several script-heavy mods (MCA, Creatures, NoM, Romance etc.) The latest was to do with Dongle's Ranger Tent mod; I pitched it outside of the two shops in Pelagiad, whenever I tried to remove it the game would CTD. This happened when I tried to remove it via the tent's own removal method and when that failed, console->disable. So I don't know what happened there, whether it was a save that became corrupt or if the mod [censored] out somehow.The point of my post is in the first line
QUOTE(Fliggerty @ Jun 11 2007, 12:33 PM)
I have a suggestion. Go into the game and make a new save. Then immediately save again, but overwrite an existing file. Then save one more time using quicksave. Compare these three files in Enchanted Editor to see what exactly is different. If overwriting a file truly causes issues, could you alter your program to do what it does for "named" saves?
Interesting thoughts. The only trouble with the test is that it's kind of hard reproduce the error, to doesn't seem to happen every time.
As far as handling named saves, I don't think it would be possible to do exactly the came thing. If I renamed a regular save, and you saved over, it would still overwrite it. Quicksave is different since it always writes to a pre-determined filename. My plan for regular save slots was that you could always use the same name for your "incremental" save slots. Save Keeper could be told to go delete all be the newest save with that name. I don't know how worth while that feature is if the Quicksave part turns out to be completely misguided.
QUOTE(ManaUser @ Jun 11 2007, 03:01 PM)
Interesting thoughts. The only trouble with the test is that it's kind of hard reproduce the error, to doesn't seem to happen every time.
As far as handling named saves, I don't think it would be possible to do exactly the came thing. If I renamed a regular save, and you saved over, it would still overwrite it. Quicksave is different since it always writes to a pre-determined filename. My plan for regular save slots was that you could always use the same name for your "incremental" save slots. Save Keeper could be told to go delete all be the newest save with that name. I don't know how worth while that feature is if the Quicksave part turns out to be completely misguided.
As far as handling named saves, I don't think it would be possible to do exactly the came thing. If I renamed a regular save, and you saved over, it would still overwrite it. Quicksave is different since it always writes to a pre-determined filename. My plan for regular save slots was that you could always use the same name for your "incremental" save slots. Save Keeper could be told to go delete all be the newest save with that name. I don't know how worth while that feature is if the Quicksave part turns out to be completely misguided.
Perhaps you'll have to just try the method over and over again until you can get the error.
Might be better to advertise for corrupted saves. At least unless there's a very good reason to expect his own quicksaves to bug out.
QUOTE(ManaUser @ Jun 11 2007, 03:01 PM)
Interesting thoughts. The only trouble with the test is that it's kind of hard reproduce the error, to doesn't seem to happen every time.
But it would certainly tell you if there is anything different about a quicksave and a normal save. Even if it doesn't produce the actual errors, I'd wager that you would still learn something from it. Realize whether or not your current program is futile, or if the problem is indeed from overwriting the same file time after time. If that is the biggest cause of issues with quicksave, I'd be more than grateful for your program!
QUOTE
As far as handling named saves, I don't think it would be possible to do exactly the came thing. If I renamed a regular save, and you saved over, it would still overwrite it. Quicksave is different since it always writes to a pre-determined filename. My plan for regular save slots was that you could always use the same name for your "incremental" save slots. Save Keeper could be told to go delete all be the newest save with that name. I don't know how worth while that feature is if the Quicksave part turns out to be completely misguided.
Just one more reason we need to get some functions in MWSE that deal with save games.
QUOTE(ManaUser @ Jun 11 2007, 12:37 PM)
It's awfully hard to know how to deal with these kind of intermittent problems until someone figures out precisely what cuases them. I've heard claims that both Quicksave and saving over existing slots what dangerous. I had been working under the assumption that Quicksave was dangerous because it normally saves over an existing slot every time. But if the quicksave function itself is broken there's but much I can do about it. I'd still like a to see a better explanation of exactly what's happening.
I'd still like a to see a better explanation of exactly what's happening.I don't think that the Quicksave function itself is 'broken'. You've got to remember it was created long before you modders started churning out the thousands of mods you can now download, so I'm pretty sure that Quicksave works just fine for vanilla Morrowind/Tribunal/Bloodmoon. The problems start when you add a hundred or so mods to your game. The more stuff that Morrowind has to keep track of, the greater chance for errors to occur.
QUOTE(Ironed Maidens @ Jun 11 2007, 02:05 PM)
Perhaps you'll have to just try the method over and over again until you can get the error.
Gee that sounds like fun.
QUOTE(Fliggerty @ Jun 11 2007, 02:41 PM)
But it would certainly tell you if there is anything different about a quicksave and a normal save. Even if it doesn't produce the actual errors, I'd wager that you would still learn something from it.
Certainly makes sense, but it's not a sure thing. One verion of the explanation I've read now is that quicksave works unless a whole scripts are running. So it might be that it works the same as anormal save, unless it runs out of space (or time, or whatever) and then something goes wrong.
Still, I'll give it a try and report back.
QUOTE(Ironed Maidens @ Jun 11 2007, 05:05 PM)
Perhaps you'll have to just try the method over and over again until you can get the error.
There is an easily & reliabably repeatable quick save error that may help with testing. With either New Suran or New Suran Extended installed get the teleport skull from the merchant in the hall of guilds. Use it then quick save. The results are... quirky. The results may shed some light on what's going on.
QUOTE(Nicholiathan @ Jun 11 2007, 04:08 PM)
There is an easily & reliabably repeatable quick save error that may help with testing. With either New Suran or New Suran Extended installed get the teleport skull from the merchant in the hall of guilds. Use it then quick save. The results are... quirky. The results may shed some light on what's going on.
Oh cool. I was hoping for something like that. I'll check it out.
If anyone else knows of a repeatable error of this type, please share.
QUOTE(Nicholiathan @ Jun 11 2007, 04:08 PM)
There is an easily & reliabably repeatable quick save error that may help with testing. With either New Suran or New Suran Extended installed get the teleport skull from the merchant in the hall of guilds. Use it then quick save. The results are... quirky. The results may shed some light on what's going on.
'Fraid I couldn't duplicate that. I'd sometimes teleport even after saving and loading a fresh named slot.
Now on the comparing saves thing, I've had mized results. (Big surprise, huh?) Here's what I did. Went to a cell with no other actors (so nothing much should be changing) and made the following saves:
A fresh named save.
Another fresh named save. (To compare as a baseline.)
A save in an existing named slot.
A Quicksave.
An Autosave.
Then I loaded them all in the Enchanted Editor and used the Dump to Text File command. (Checked Dump Header Information, left other settings at defaults.) Then I compared the dump of the first save to each of the other four using a Unix-style "diff" command (with the -a option for text mode), redirecting the output to new next tiles. Most of them had the following differences:
- The name of the save slot.
- Current game time (twice, once in the header, once a s variable).
- The Random100 variable.
- The map. (I have no idea why this changed, but it did, consistantly).
And the last word is BLARGH.
I had a frequent quicksave crashes if I save the game very short before a new exterior cell load. Hope this helps.
I am guilty of perpetuating the notion that quicksaves were inherently less reliable than conventional saves. While trying to duplicate the conditions that result in corrupted data experienced by players having problems with (earlier) versions of Traveling Merchants, quicksaves were the only way that I could be ‘successful’. Many (most?) players experiencing missing reference errors admitted to using quicksave. My ‘evidence’ is largely anecdotal, but Wrye offered an interesting explanation in a thread now two years old about how quicksave could become corrupted:
The continuously running scripts in Traveling Merchants would make it particularly vulnerable to this problem, if it actually occurs. Since autosave (resting) involves an open menu that may pause script function (menumode == 1), it may be less susceptible to this write problem.
ManaUser: For whatever reason quicksaves (and possibly autosaves) may be less reliable, I applaud your efforts to save us from our own laziness.
QUOTE(Wyre)
I don't think that this will help you, but...
Re, quicksave problems... I would think that the file format would be exactly the same, so that shouldn't be a problem. However, because of the conditions under which quicksaves are run, there might be some typical gamestate differences. Two possibilities... Non-quicksaves are launched from game menu. While the game menu is showing, I imagine that menumode == 1 and/or all scripts are suspended. Now, from what I've heard, under heavy load conditions a given script may not complete running during a frame -- in which case it will half complete in one frame and finish completing in the next (or some later frame). Meanwhile the game state is still changing, so some conditions that are tested at the beginning of script may not be true later in the script. But for non-quicksaves, I think that you would be guaranteed that scripts are either not running at all or are completed in a single frame. (If menumode == 1, then a lot of scripts are short circuited at the top by "if menumode, then return" tests.) (Okay, that's a little confused, but basically, I think that the gamestate may be less reliable during quicksaves then it is during ordinary saves). But like I said, I don't think that helps you.
BTW. If you use Wrye Mash to delete a master from a save game (uncheck in master list and then hit "Save"), it will delete all modified references placed by that master, but not change any globals, journals, scripts, etc. If you then play the game (with game also removed from load masters) almost all other mod related data will be removed (except globals). OTOH, if you add the master back in (sync to load list, Save), and then play, then everything will be the same except for the references that have just been deleted. Again, don't know if that will help, but it's something that can go in your bag of tricks.
Re, quicksave problems... I would think that the file format would be exactly the same, so that shouldn't be a problem. However, because of the conditions under which quicksaves are run, there might be some typical gamestate differences. Two possibilities... Non-quicksaves are launched from game menu. While the game menu is showing, I imagine that menumode == 1 and/or all scripts are suspended. Now, from what I've heard, under heavy load conditions a given script may not complete running during a frame -- in which case it will half complete in one frame and finish completing in the next (or some later frame). Meanwhile the game state is still changing, so some conditions that are tested at the beginning of script may not be true later in the script. But for non-quicksaves, I think that you would be guaranteed that scripts are either not running at all or are completed in a single frame. (If menumode == 1, then a lot of scripts are short circuited at the top by "if menumode, then return" tests.) (Okay, that's a little confused, but basically, I think that the gamestate may be less reliable during quicksaves then it is during ordinary saves). But like I said, I don't think that helps you.
BTW. If you use Wrye Mash to delete a master from a save game (uncheck in master list and then hit "Save"), it will delete all modified references placed by that master, but not change any globals, journals, scripts, etc. If you then play the game (with game also removed from load masters) almost all other mod related data will be removed (except globals). OTOH, if you add the master back in (sync to load list, Save), and then play, then everything will be the same except for the references that have just been deleted. Again, don't know if that will help, but it's something that can go in your bag of tricks.
The continuously running scripts in Traveling Merchants would make it particularly vulnerable to this problem, if it actually occurs. Since autosave (resting) involves an open menu that may pause script function (menumode == 1), it may be less susceptible to this write problem.
ManaUser: For whatever reason quicksaves (and possibly autosaves) may be less reliable, I applaud your efforts to save us from our own laziness.
If that is indeed the case, a quicksave should be okay so long as MenuMode == 1. Hmm....can you do a quicksave while the menu is open? Don't think I've ever tried.
How about trying the save experiment with a bunch of script intensive mods loaded, like Vampire Embrace, Vampire Realism, Morrowind Comes Alive, and The Underground? If all of the anecdotal evidence concerning Quicksave is true, there should be a big difference between a regular save and a Quicksave.
QUOTE(dividebyzero @ Jun 11 2007, 11:05 PM)
I had a frequent quicksave crashes if I save the game very short before a new exterior cell load. Hope this helps.
Hmm that would seem to indicate that Quicksaving takes a little longer to finish than the proggress bar indicates (and changing cells interupts it). You might be on to something there, I also thought I notcied noticed a bit of a delay with Save Keeper (which plays a sound whena renames a a newly written Quicksave).
QUOTE(Fliggerty @ Jun 12 2007, 06:21 AM)
If that is indeed the case, a quicksave should be okay so long as MenuMode == 1. Hmm....can you do a quicksave while the menu is open? Don't think I've ever tried.
You can't. But I wonder if it would help (or hurt) to use the ToggleScripts console command prior to saving.
QUOTE(Nerra @ Jun 12 2007, 06:51 AM)
How about trying the save experiment with a bunch of script intensive mods loaded, like Vampire Embrace, Vampire Realism, Morrowind Comes Alive, and The Underground? If all of the anecdotal evidence concerning Quicksave is true, there should be a big difference between a regular save and a Quicksave.
Yes, definitely worth a try. (Though oddly enough, the one time I got Quicksave to be different, I had a minimal set of mods loaded.)
I'd suggest experimenting with GCD. It ALWAYS gave me errors after a while if I kept using the same save file. Now I make sure I create a new one often, so I can finally use it!
That's why this is my request/idea:
By pressing the F5 key a save is made just like a regular save. The player will just have to assign the quicksave (or quiksave as Bethesda spelled it) to something else. Every time you save with the F5 key a new save file is created called 'Safe-save X' or something like that, where X is the number. It can keep 20 saves and after that it will first remove the oldest Safe-save, and then make a new one (so that's not overwriting). Regular saves won't be deleted.
I don't know much about MWSE, but I'm guessing this is possible by using it.
QUOTE
One of the problems I've read about with Quicksave doesn't have to do with corruption, but with how it actually saves games. Quicksave doesn't always save all data concerning running scripts, so when you go to load up your last Quicksave, you get lots of errors and some of your mods are no longer running properly. That's why I tell people not to use Quicksave.
That's why this is my request/idea:
By pressing the F5 key a save is made just like a regular save. The player will just have to assign the quicksave (or quiksave as Bethesda spelled it) to something else. Every time you save with the F5 key a new save file is created called 'Safe-save X' or something like that, where X is the number. It can keep 20 saves and after that it will first remove the oldest Safe-save, and then make a new one (so that's not overwriting). Regular saves won't be deleted.
I don't know much about MWSE, but I'm guessing this is possible by using it.
I use quicksaves while out and about on a quest and hardsaves at the end of each quest and session
is that safe?
is that safe?
QUOTE(Darknut @ Jun 11 2007, 02:40 PM)
I have played MW for hundreds of hours & I have never once had a corrupt quicksave & I quicksave alot!
I "name" save alot too.
I "name" save alot too.
That is what I do too. For every 2 quicksaves, I do a name save. and prior to leaving game I do a name save, so I load from it to resume playing aftwards.
Next day I remove all but the last 3 saves into an 'old_saves' folder.
QUOTE(povuholo @ Jun 19 2007, 04:05 AM)
I don't know much about MWSE, but I'm guessing this is possible by using it.
Nope. MWSE currently can only read and write to files in the MWSE directory in Data Files. There's no way it can help with preventing corrupted saves right now.
Here's my $.02 on the subject, which may or may not be helpful at all.
I quicksave quite a bit, because I am lazy. I think in the 4 years I've been playing Morrowind I've had 1, maybe 2, corrupt quicksaves. I don't use that many script-heavy mods, because in the 4 years I've been playing Morrowind, I haven't upgraded my computer much at all. I do however use MWE and MWSE (as well as GCD and haven't had any problems there).
Wrye's logic seems very good to me, so here's what I was thinking:
Would it be possible to have a quick key so that when you pressed it, it would go to menu, wait a frame or two to make sure all scripts have done their thing and then trigger a quicksave?
I have absolutely zero knowledge of MWSE, except that Fliggerty has done amazing things with it, so maybe it's possible, maybe not.
I quicksave quite a bit, because I am lazy. I think in the 4 years I've been playing Morrowind I've had 1, maybe 2, corrupt quicksaves. I don't use that many script-heavy mods, because in the 4 years I've been playing Morrowind, I haven't upgraded my computer much at all. I do however use MWE and MWSE (as well as GCD and haven't had any problems there).
Wrye's logic seems very good to me, so here's what I was thinking:
Would it be possible to have a quick key so that when you pressed it, it would go to menu, wait a frame or two to make sure all scripts have done their thing and then trigger a quicksave?
I have absolutely zero knowledge of MWSE, except that Fliggerty has done amazing things with it, so maybe it's possible, maybe not.
Sorry, I haven't checked this thread for a while.
That's a worth-while idea, navigating the menu may be a little hard to automate with AutoHotkey (the software I made this with, I think I menioned that), but if it can be done, that may well be the best option.
Probably not. Whatever the source of quicksave corruption is, it seems likely that using it at all is risky. Making regular "named" saves does have the advantage that if your quicksave does get corrupted you won't lose as much work, assuming the corruption is always obvious.
As I pointed out above, it's not possible to make a quicksave with the menu open, but using ToggleScripts, could possibly work.
Anyway, to tell you all the truth I'm starting to get a little discouraged with this project, it seems despite any experiment we devise there are no clear answers about exactly what the root of the problem is, perhaps their are more than one problem. Maybe I just don't have the patience it takes.
QUOTE(povuholo @ Jun 19 2007, 03:05 AM)
I'd suggest experimenting with GCD. It ALWAYS gave me errors after a while if I kept using the same save file. Now I make sure I create a new one often, so I can finally use it!
That's why this is my request/idea:
By pressing the F5 key a save is made just like a regular save. The player will just have to assign the quicksave (or quiksave as Bethesda spelled it) to something else. Every time you save with the F5 key a new save file is created called 'Safe-save X' or something like that, where X is the number. It can keep 20 saves and after that it will first remove the oldest Safe-save, and then make a new one (so that's not overwriting). Regular saves won't be deleted.
That's why this is my request/idea:
By pressing the F5 key a save is made just like a regular save. The player will just have to assign the quicksave (or quiksave as Bethesda spelled it) to something else. Every time you save with the F5 key a new save file is created called 'Safe-save X' or something like that, where X is the number. It can keep 20 saves and after that it will first remove the oldest Safe-save, and then make a new one (so that's not overwriting). Regular saves won't be deleted.
That's a worth-while idea, navigating the menu may be a little hard to automate with AutoHotkey (the software I made this with, I think I menioned that), but if it can be done, that may well be the best option.
QUOTE(Mural @ Jun 19 2007, 04:29 AM)
I use quicksaves while out and about on a quest and hardsaves at the end of each quest and session
is that safe?
is that safe?
Probably not. Whatever the source of quicksave corruption is, it seems likely that using it at all is risky. Making regular "named" saves does have the advantage that if your quicksave does get corrupted you won't lose as much work, assuming the corruption is always obvious.
QUOTE(Taylin @ Jun 19 2007, 11:06 AM)
Here's my $.02 on the subject, which may or may not be helpful at all.
I quicksave quite a bit, because I am lazy. I think in the 4 years I've been playing Morrowind I've had 1, maybe 2, corrupt quicksaves. I don't use that many script-heavy mods, because in the 4 years I've been playing Morrowind, I haven't upgraded my computer much at all. I do however use MWE and MWSE (as well as GCD and haven't had any problems there).
Wrye's logic seems very good to me, so here's what I was thinking:
Would it be possible to have a quick key so that when you pressed it, it would go to menu, wait a frame or two to make sure all scripts have done their thing and then trigger a quicksave?
I quicksave quite a bit, because I am lazy. I think in the 4 years I've been playing Morrowind I've had 1, maybe 2, corrupt quicksaves. I don't use that many script-heavy mods, because in the 4 years I've been playing Morrowind, I haven't upgraded my computer much at all. I do however use MWE and MWSE (as well as GCD and haven't had any problems there).
Wrye's logic seems very good to me, so here's what I was thinking:
Would it be possible to have a quick key so that when you pressed it, it would go to menu, wait a frame or two to make sure all scripts have done their thing and then trigger a quicksave?
As I pointed out above, it's not possible to make a quicksave with the menu open, but using ToggleScripts, could possibly work.
Anyway, to tell you all the truth I'm starting to get a little discouraged with this project, it seems despite any experiment we devise there are no clear answers about exactly what the root of the problem is, perhaps their are more than one problem. Maybe I just don't have the patience it takes.
QUOTE(ManaUser @ Jun 21 2007, 08:24 PM)
As I pointed out above, it's not possible to make a quicksave with the menu open, but using ToggleScripts, could possibly work.
So you did...proves how carefully I was reading.
QUOTE
Anyway, to tell you all the truth I'm starting to get a little discouraged with this project, it seems despite any experiment we devise there are no clear answers about exactly what the root of the problem is, perhaps their are more than one problem. Maybe I just don't have the patience it takes.
Even if you can't solve every problem, I'd still encourage you to keep working on. I for one would be glad of having my quicksaves increment, since even if one corrupted, I'd still have the previous save.
Also, I'd be happy to beta test if you still need anybody.
